"If you depart from moral absolutes, you go into a bottomless pit.
Communism and Naziism were catastrophic evils which both derived from moral relativism.
Their differences were minor compared to their similarities."
by:
Paul Johnson
Historian
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The moral relativism of the above stated socialist applications, along with all other despotic forms of legal positivism's totalitarianism, rely on a form of moral absolutes. Morality can not be lawfully legislated. Morality is a discernible or judgmental expose' on any given act. Natural law, or just law, is a definitive attribute of an entities expression (for example; apples that fall continually from a tree are explained by the law of gravity - or - expenditures exceeding the ability to repay is explained by the fiscal law, bankruptcy). Morals are a secondary discernment, addressing action only. Law is the definitive action describing matter's attributes. Morality is based on law, not the other way around. If one departs from the moral absolutes of law's freedom, liberty, and individual rights, socialism's catastrophic evils are but one of the depraved atrocities that await.
 -- Mike, Norwalk     
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    Clothing the naked, feeding the poor, giving the otherwise indigent opportunity to prosper themselves, and according assistance when needed are all moral absolutes of religious man. Not evil in and of themselves. When mandated by government through theocratic regulation and statute, the evil of injustice and catastrophes such as socialism (communism to fascism, progressivism to neo-conism, etc.) demonstrate the relativism of the bottomless pit.
     -- Mike, Norwalk     
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    Whose moral absolutes? Pat Robertson's? Shouldn't the the moral absolutes of Moses and Mohammad be honored? How about letting the Vatican run everything - again? Remember? "Believe what I say, do as I say, especially the part re. providing my PAY" - or be burned at the stake, then spend Eternity in everlasting torment. Oh, ye are also Commanded: Never Forget: 'God Loves you.' Zero stars, five belly laughs. Interesting take, Norwalk, though I think it fails in the end, for whatever that may be worth. Your description appears to have the differing, however much conjoined characteristics of one's PERCEPTION and AWARENESS, arising as a result of matter - instead of being independent of matter in their origins. Before firing back, be aware that I know your opinions regarding these kinds of things are just as valid as mine - and just as unverifiable in this here-and-now.
     -- Mann, Kalamazoo     
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    Mann, my fire back is to agree with you. I may be the most hard core believing Christian you have ever come across but, that is my personal knowledge / belief / opinion. I believe in the law as the Christ portrayed it; not the moral absolutes of your stated - or other following totalitarians. Whether the opinion is yours or mine, none is more or less valid than the other. It only becomes a catastrophic evil when those opinions are forced on another, an innocent third party. My opinion is that if you had included Hitler, Mao, Stalin, Mr. Obamunist Goodwrench the assassin to your ancient Vatican reference, it would have been more complete ;-) Mann, thank you for contributing here, the more intelligent the comments (from all perspectives), the greater the increase and awareness of knowledge.
     -- Mike, Norwalk     
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    Moral relativism is the key here -- that is to say, what is 'moral' is merely whatever the powers-that-be decide it is. If there are natural laws, then there are moral absolutes as well. It has always been the responsibility of humankind to discover them and act in harmony with them BECAUSE there are always consequences to our actions -- again, a natural law. Totalitarianism is the ability to define the morals of a nation and impose them by force, so naturally moral relativism is a tool of the despot, whether ecclesiastical or secular, history bears witness to the truth of it.
     -- E Archer, NYC     
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    Moral laws are in line with natural law...or they simply aren't moral laws. Religion has nothing to do with moral law except where the two cross over, probably by accident.
     -- J Carlton, Calgary     
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    J Carlton, I could write a book on your comment and why it is so accurate. I usually don't express myself as well as you or Archer but, there is a lot of back ground to be laid to really explain what you've stated. To start with, the accurate discernment of natural law is moral. That which is contrary to natural law (murder, larceny, socialism, etc.) displays a criminal's morals.
     -- Mike, Norwalk     
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    Thanks Mike, I get lucky sometimes and actually say something that is in line with what I consider my "cut to the chase" nature. :)
     -- J Carlton, Calgary     
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    If truth doesn't exist, then it's hard to take "relativism" seriously. Aristotle mentioned that it's very difficult to maintain "categorical negations" such as there are no absolutes in morals and ethics. One would have to do much searching, studying, and proving in order to assert such a worldview, and yet the people I find asserting it usually have done little research other than some shallow introspection, and even then it comes across as self-deception.
     -- Paul, Naples     
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    The problem lies not in the non-existence of truth; surely truth exists. The problem lies in the near-universal human insistence that MY/OUR perceptions of truth and reality are supreme and correct in the face of all others - hence MY/OUR overwhelming imperative to impose this vision of 'truth' on everybody else. PERSONAL 'truth', even if group-oriented (family, religious, political etc.) in nature, doesn't suffer competition well. Nor does it seem to matter whether the 'true believer' is an Evangelical Dominionist, a practitioner of fundamental Islam or a powerful purveyor of Pax Americana. All are SELF-empowered to kill others for daring to believe their own views of things are as valid as "mine." Tolerance and balance are the two keys - and seemingly absent.
     -- Mann, Kalamazoo     
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     -- Roland, Bonner's Ferry      
    Without regard to ideological pretense, barbarism is barbarism.
     -- Patrick Henry, Red Hill     
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    As the founding fathers of America demonstrated, they put not their trust in man. This the Declaration declares before all nations. In the attempt to bridle designing fanciful whims and the lust to centralize power, the Constitutional compact came forth in defense of the Declaration. Throughout all generations the cry of humankind against oppression, when finding no other, turns to the unseen Creator. " I waited patiently for the Lord; and he inclined unto me and heard my cry. He brought me up also out of an horrible pit, out of the miry clay, and set my feet upon a rock, and established my goings. And he hath put a new song in my mouth, even praises unto our God: many shall see it, and fear, and shall trust in the Lord. Blessed is that man that maketh the Lord his trust, and respecteth not the proud, nor such as turn aside to lies." Psalm 40:1-4
    " If you depart from moral absolutes, you go into a bottomless pit." such is the decline of an individual, nation, community, society or family. " Honesty to stand with thee, charity to walk with thee", this is required of all servants who would be administers of Liberty and Freedom. nondenominational in nature, that of a good conscience toward God, his nature and mankind. " what type of "truth" can be well defined and absolute, yet there are always those that appose themselves.
     -- Ronw13, OR     
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