"The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to Socialism."
by:
Karl Marx
(1818-1883) German philosopher, father of Communism, co-author of the 'Communist Manifesto'
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 -- Anonymous      
 -- Craig, Victoria      
OK, I smiled to the point of an almost giggle. Ahh yes, "A lie told often enough becomes the truth" (Lenin - just another Communist putting scope to the quote)
 -- Mike, Norwalk     
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    Marx was writing in an era when men erected great edifices to ideas and puffed out their chests. We are living in a post-linguistic, post-factual era. Strangely enough, this comports with the way our universe actually works, proving that adage about politics making strange bedfellows. Since the 1920s physicists using increasingly sensitive instruments to make observations based on thought experiments of the kind that allowed Newton to formulate his laws of gravitation and motion which was a complete closed system for sending probes to Mars, Venus, and eventually men to the moon. However on larger scales and much smaller scales Newton's world view has been supplanted twice, first by Einstein and then by the Copenhagen Interpretation out of which our current Observer-created Multiverse is the most comprehensive model of the way things really work. Though it is by no means a complete picture; in fact it strongly suggests that there is no objective reality. Hence: facts have fallen in stature. They are now seen as merely points of view. Opinions. And everyone is entitled to their opinions in America. So says the founding documents, which we might consider re-applying where they've weakened or broken down entirely. I don't hold out much hope for this project to come from anybody in elected office - and certainly doubt very strongly that a plurality could be mustered to support passing any of the first 10 Amendments which were once crucial to the very existence of the USA at the birth of the nation. We are blessed to live in one of the few countries ever founded on good ideas. Only the kabuki show of politics (which exists for us as a Universe which can only count up to 2: polemical thinking is not just the norm, it's very hard for people to imagine how much ill has been created by false dichotomies...when there are far more than 2 points of view, versions of events, realities. For America it's close to 300,000,000 - the number of individuals with nervous systems and magnificent brains of whom it is said "All men (& women) are created equal and endowed with liberties." Not just "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" but in fact any activity - so long as it hurts no one else nor damages or destroys the property of another or others - is nobody's business but yours, yours, and mine. We've got a problem then since 3 million (1 out of every 100) fellow "sovereigns" sits behind bars...over half for committing consensual crimes where they are both perpetrator and victim. This is foolishness and it infantilizes the population in a state of victimhood, blaming others, and not taking personal responsibility. Before the Declaration of Independence the Colonists were not sovereigns -- there was only one sovereign, King George of England. In the world view then current your soul belonged to God and your body belonged to the King or Queen. Unless we grow up and reclaim our adult status we will see more and more of our rights-responsibilities viewed with suspicion. For now it's unconventional forms of intoxication such as marijuana. Tomorrow it will be guns. For certainly if we are not to be trusted with controlling our own states of mind and what we choose to put in our bodies then it can and will be argued very soon that the same is true of firearms. Where does it end: totalitarianism, Authoritarian Dictatorships of One or of a Cabal (also called a Cartel) of corporations whose loyalty to the U.S. Constitution is nil. Here's the good news: you matter. In fact it all hinges on you.... Good luck and we'll regroup after hopefully destroying the Death Star.
     -- Anonymous, Los Angeles     
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    Marx's bufoonery made the 20th century a dark time in western history, perhaps only rivaled by the late middle ages. As to his quote, the opposition to his tyrannical ideas will only stop when the ideas are utterly disproven and laughed about by wiser men or when every human is destroyed. In the case of the latter I suppose he is correct.
     -- Justin, Elkland     
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    I'm guessing that the purpose of having a Marx quote is to give us the opposition of liberty. Marx and liberty go together as well as oil and water.
     -- Kevin, Windber     
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     -- J Allen, Arlington, Va      
    I concur. Marxism is not compatible with the US Constitution and I thought these quotes of the day were going to come from real great men who actually did great things.... but this puts the icing on the cake. outta here....
     -- Christian, Louisville, KY     
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    Christian, Louisville, Marx did "great things", unfortunatly these things resulted in the slavery and murder of millions of people.
     -- jim k, Austin,Tx     
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    I liked Kevin's analogy but I'll go him one better...Marxism and Liberty go together like Islam and Bikini's.
     -- J Carlton, Calgary     
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    And to think our so called great Abraham Lincoln exchanged letters with him. Total federal control of our nation began in 1861.
     -- cal, lewisville, tx     
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    This is exactly what is being fed to us and has been for more than a century. And I guess the One and his cohorts will force-feed it to us until we no longer oppose his twisted ideas for America. Then they'll call it peace. It's called "twistory."
     -- Carol, Georgia     
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    I give it a one becuase I am sure that this was true for Max just as peace to a Muslim is the absence of opposition to their belief system. Most folk including I would bet a few on this blog would have a feeling of peace or euphoria if all would accept their politcal belief system. (Intersting comment about the exchane of letters Cal. Did you know that the Pople Pius XII exhanged letters with Jeffeson Davis. That is considered diplomatic recognition by the Vatican, the only politcal power to do so. It would appear that the Vatican would like to see the secular USA fail.)
     -- Waffler, Smith     
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    Unfortunately those with the thumbs down have not read Karl Marx "Das Kapital" and Friedrich Engels to appreciate this quote. If they had things may be different both here and in the rest of the country.
     -- RBESRQ     
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    So, you have all been here since 1861 AND done WHAT? What hypocrites you are - I suppose I can say that Christianity and Compassion go together like Hitler and Gandhi. And Capitalism and Liberty go together like Murdoch and the Dalai Lama. Oh, and by the way, when you did land here in America you killed off the Indians and stole all their land - what a nice bunch of people you are. What a history for a so called Christian nation. Mass extermination, slavery for 250 years, the overthrow of 50 democratically elected governments (and that since the end of WWll). O yes, what a wonderful country we have.
     -- RBESRQ     
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    Karl Marx was a saint in comparison...
     -- RBESRQ     
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    "The meaning of either exploited, vegetating, conformist or chatting people" should he say.
     -- Elizabeth, Astoria, NY     
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    Karl Marx on liberty, the same one who's theory was that people should work and live for the state, not themselves, how is this have anything to do with liberty? The person who commented on how capitalism and liberty go together has never read the "wealth of nations"
     -- Anonymous     
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    There is much truth here and it is very sad that so many readers here have not the patience or open-mindedness to have ever given it any real consideration. Thank you, RBESRQ, for taking the time to make a real argument.
     -- dick, fort worth     
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    FDR identifed "Peace" on the eve of his 1936 reelection when he said, "We had to struggle with the old enemies of peace-business and financial monopoly, speculation, reckless banking, class antagonism, sectionalism, war profiteering. They had begun to consider the Government of the United States as a mere appe;ndage to their own affairs. We know now that Government by organized money is just as dangerous as Government by organized mob." Peace is somewhere, but where, between the extremes of socialism and capitalism. Lets all agree to keep searching for it. Maybe peace is the death of extemism. ;
     -- Waffler, Smith     
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    dullards and communists. What has happened here? The people making these comments would drown in a reflecting pond dept of insight and perception.
     -- joe, Rochester, mn     
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    If socialism were a consideration then our forefathers would have sided with it. But liberty being ordained of God is freedom secured from an oppressive government. But freedom and liberty, personal and financial, were sold under the lie called security or socialism. The great generation knows very well the theft committed against the American people under FDRs administration. With other lies perpetrated by such a godless group of people seeking to further their new world order.
     -- Ron, Salem     
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    Liberety does not mean freedom from government anymore than it does freedom through govermental action and policy from tyrannical individuals, financila fraudsters, crimianals of all types. Americans have freedom because of our government.
     -- Waffler, Smith     
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    Robert, I have read Karl Marx "Das Kapital" and Friedrich Engels and don't believe most of their premises or conclusions. Of course there were threads of truth woven through their socialist grumblings and desires to be more affluent but, their cause and effects were absurd. As to pure capitalism, I'm not a fan (the free market, when operated within natural law, is a totally separate concept and issue), it is just the other end of socialism's immorality and totalitarian stick. Marx appeared to have an extremely poor work ethic and found it easier to live off Engels and inheritance. As such, Marx found it easier to associate with socialist intellectuals of the day, finding fault rather than actually doing something productive. As an economist, he was a dismal failure with his concepts bringing more pain, suffering, and poverty than that which he was complaining about.
     -- Mike, Norwalk     
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    Marx and Engels were employed by the League of just Men to formulize a plan of action for the same . marx didn't have his name attached to the formulization until 20 yrs latter. Robert Welch in 1969 gave a 3 hr talk on the whole scheme of things .-DCC
     -- Dave, Turlock     
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    RBESRQ evidently has no American pride! Just curious why you live here? You're free to move to another country and denounce your citizenship so you can live amongst a nicer bunch of people.
     -- BS61, AZ     
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    BS61 yes, I will be leaving, like most who are intelligent, though there was a moment when I thought I would stay and fight but then I thought of people like you and decided it wasn't worth. I have pride in people and countries that deserve it and America has lost its integrity and its moral and ethical standing.
     -- RBESRQ     
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    Goodness gracious, Robert. You have never given reason why you left your birth place England for the US -- now because America hasn't embraced socialism enough for you, you are leaving? Curious as to what utopian world embodies your form of moral and ethical standing. Interesting that you point out that the US military killed millions of native Americans -- it seems par for the course considering British/European/Roman imperialism has done most of the conquering in the last millenium. Socialism is just another form of war.
     -- E Archer, NYC     
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    "Is life so dear or peace so sweet to be purchased at the price of chains and irons?"
     -- Publius, USA     
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    Every society gets the government it deserves. What that society deserves depends on the amount of opposition it has to what it doesn't want. If there is no opposition to unwanted ideas the People will deserve the "peace" that the unhonorable marx speaks of. But if We the People stand and fight, oppose the sinful doctrine of redistribution of wealth, and "eat our own bread", there will be no peace. But we will deserve, earn, and embrace something better, LIBERTY.
     -- Publius, USA     
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    If you have two cows and your neighbor has one. You feed yours everyday, nurse them when they're sick, and make sure the pen is strong and sturdy. Your neighbor doesn't take care of his. He doesn't feed it regularly or protect it from illness. Your neighbor's cow dies. Then the government takes one of yours and gives it to your neighbor so that each of you have one cow, an equal distribution of wealth. Is that right? Is that liberty and justice? Nope, its socialism.
     -- Damon, Long Hammock, FL     
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    what forms of socialism scare you people the most? is our our public library system? public transportation? social security (okay, give your check back when your old), medicare? public education, so much socialism exists in our society already. not perfect but has bettered the lives of millions, medicare lifted millions out of poverty...
     -- ali, sag harbor, ny     
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    Where does Marx say this?
     -- vin maratty, sunderland     
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    Marx, in his personal habitudes, was a perfect personification of the ethos of his contemptible creed.
     -- Patrick Henry, Red Hill     
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    I disagree with this quote in a direct sense but would find some credit in a more general interpretation. The meaning of peace is not the lack of opposition to socialism or anything for that matter but the acceptance of difference and the rights of those who express difference. When difference cannot be tolerated then we're in trouble. Motivation for much of Marx and Engles' Communist Manifesto was reactive to poverty and misery directly observed in places like Salford where Engles lived among the working class factory, mine and mill workers in West Manchester in the slums of the time and where people lived like animals on subsistent wages. The means of production were owned for the profit of the wealthy few. Their demand for change came from their perceived need for the compassionate redistribution of wealth for the benefit of all. Their perception was that people were enslaved by Capitalism and would be set free by Socialism to share in a common way accepting that we are all interdependent on many levels. This is predicated on the acceptance of universal human and worker rights and an acceptance of difference certainly in respect to individual needs and relationship to the means of production. Having said that, much that has been done in the name of socialism that ignores this plea for humanity.
     -- Mick, Manchester     
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    True socialism is the key to peace not the faux socialism of the left.
     -- Robert, Somewhere in the US     
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    The biggest benefactors of socialism in the US is the Pentagon, the banks, and the corporate boardrooms (they are the biggest welfare recipients $trillions) and you talk about socialism, give me a break - you have no idea what the hell you are talking about. The MIC loses the accountability for $2 trillion in a fake bomb attack on the pentagon and your complaining and getting angry over peanuts. Soon you will be chipped like your dogs and then you will say what happened to out freedom and liberty. So, wake-up and bring back a real world to America unless the one you currently have is to your liking.
     -- Robert, Somewhere in the US     
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    Yes, Karl Marx was a saint - his philosophy was twisted and used in the negative. Mike, I know you said you read his works, if you had then you would know Marx was a true person for world peace. Instead of this war machine you all worship....
     -- Robert, Somewhere in the US     
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    Robert, you show your true colors, which contradict any classical liberal defense you have made before. You are right that the banks (and to all they provide 'credit') are the biggest benefactors of socialism -- central banking of fiat currency is an ESSENTIAL plank of communism. Show me an uncorrupt socialist/communist government to emulate -- Russia had to return to the free market if they were ever to break out of perpetual poverty. Today's advocates of socialism ignore that under socialist rule, the wealth of the 'rich' is taken by the new communist aristocracy (the Politburo) and the common people must either join the Red Army or starve.

    The 'promise' of socialism is a LIE -- it cannot be fulfilled because each person is ultimately responsible for the condition and quality of one's life. Such arrogance of authoritarianism stinks. Being born is not victimhood! Wake up and thank God for the gift that this life is -- stop blaming others, it is childish, grow up. Double-think is designed to arrest reason and can appeal to emotion only. Good grief.
     -- E Archer, NYC     
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    Just to clarify, Robert, is communist China the 'real' socialism (not the "faux socialism of the left")? How about North Korea (very clean, no crime)? How about Venezuela (which you have expressed support for in the past)? Cuba? How about Russia? Do you know how many people were wiped out by these socialists? Socialism is government of central banks -- they are the real 'governors', they hold the world's capital as collateral and all of us must pay rent for the use of the money supply, which is used for all of life's economic transactions. Call it what you will, but the central banks are at the top of the pyramid. Remove this plank, socialism in the Western world would collapse -- our only salvation would be that those that survived would NOT REPEAT the corruption.
     -- E Archer, NYC     
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